What would you do?

sharring · Tiger Joined: 04 Feb 2004 Posts: 812 Location: Texas

Our drummer belongs to this small church that meets on Saturday night. They use another church's facilities and then clean up before they leave. I have been sitting in with them intermittantly on electric guitar and everyone's been so complementry it's embarressing. Anyway, they have their first anniversery meeting and they ask me to please come. So I make special arrangements at work (i work 12 hour shifts at the hospital). I've always felt a weird vibe coming from the bass player-he is actually the guitar player when i'm not there. We work up 3 songs before the service and then break. Everyone is in fellowship with members coming in so i go to check on my 6yo. We meet to pray before starting the service. I kick off the first song like we practiced and the bass player is talking to the church........a minute later he is still talking! Finally, after i feel i've been hung out to dry he come's in with the rest of the band. Whew! Musta been some miscommunication or something. The second song is some tune by Delerous? with a pounding guitar intro E to F#. So after making eye contact with everyone Exclamation

i kick it off...and my low E string is waaaaay out of tune! Now i checked the tuning before i left to see my 6yo-i use a TU-2 as my only pedal. And it's a tele with the strings broken in-i know my gear and it just doesn't drift like this! The bass player stops the tune, turns around and stares at me while i correct it. I'm starting to feel like someone is out to get me. The third song goes by without any problem. We all take our seats in the pews for the service. The bass player is passing the offering tray and apoligizes to me for stopping the song. Brothers, i think it was him who detuned my string. I've already forgiven him in my heart-i've look foolish before, it's not a new thing. But i sure don't want to play there again (his intention?). Should i talk about this to my drummer? It's his church and i know he is going to ask me to play again. What would you do? In His hands-scott

Bates15 · Moderator Joined: 19 Feb 2002 Posts: 1084

Auch. Not a nice problem to have. I would give it a talk. I am sure I would go to the bass player and talk it out. Not to point the finger but to get to know his heart. Is he offended by you coming in to play, does he feel like you are taking over? I dont know about the rest of you but i would take him out to a restaurant or so (guitar shops always work) and pick his mind. Anyway, you cant just leave can you?

Steve · Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2004 5:27 am Post subject:

Beyond what happened that time, would you enjoy playing there again?

Elton Trueblood was a great Christian writer who wrote a book called, "A place to Stand."
Essentially it was about adopting Christ as a personal anchor in life, but I often think of the phrase, "a place to stand," as a encouragement to carve out a niche for ourselves in the face of adversity, no matter where that adversity comes from.

In the New Testament book of James, he tells us to "make friends with adversity," because we're going to be exposed to a lot of it!

I have had to recognize that sometimes when dealing with so-called "Christian" musicians, they may still be struggling with power plays, and other things that stand in their way of becoming more like Jesus (which is the whole point of being a Christian, right?).

Musicians generally are an egotistical lot, and not everybody matures at the same rate.
If you want to continue there, perhaps God will use you to demonstrate how a Christian deals with common day to day adversity, even if it is being designed by somebody who is threatened by your presence.

At my job this morning I have an excellent opportunity to let things degrade to the "power play" level (believe me, as a Supervisor, there are daily attacks on my authority): OR, having been given the authority, I can use my God given wisdom to SERVE, and thereby carve out a place for myself to stand in the face of adversity.

Jesus is with us, even to the end of the age. I can do it alone, the "old man" way. Or I can look for Jesus to show me the way, and I will see opportunities to be a peacemaker. Humility comes from strength, in the final analysis, and God's strength is revealed in our weakness. I don't need to play "power plays" or take assertiveness training. I just need to keep my eyes on He who went to the cross to defeat Satan once and for all.

With that as my perspective, I have battled with church musicians who were evil and did not even know how evil they were being. We all have the potential to be evil in someone else's eyes. If that other player is doing dirty tricks to you, I doubt he even recognizes where that stuff comes from, in the final analysis. He's being used by the adversary. A direct attack will make you look foolish. We cannot fight alone, by our own wits, with he who is looking as a roaring lion to devour us, using our own fleshly desires and statis to do so.
It is easy to let the devil separate us into factions (party spirit), but we are encouraged to take "the shield of Faith" which snuffs out the fire darts thrown by our enemy (old world shields were covered by thick leather, which would absorb those firey barbs, snuffing them out).

Jesus did not fight back tooth and claw as we are tempted to do. He carved out a place to stand, through humility, and changed the whole world's value system.

If you want to play again at that church, know what the real challenge is about, then ask the Lord whether or not He wants you to be a "fool" for Him.

Ferrari 1 · Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2004 5:48 am Post subject:

Scott,
I feel your pain, brother. If it were me, I would not personalize it, unless I KNEW it was him messing with me. It is possible that something else happened. It does seem a bit odd, though.

I agree with the others, that it would be best to speak to him about his heart and his feelings about you playing. Then listen, not only to what he says, but what he DOESN'T say. You will know.

God can and will use this situation for good.

I have had 2 separate instances over the last several years in my church where I have been under attack. The first was with one of the music pastors who was WAY out of line. I took it on the chin ( on my very wise wife's advice) and let it play out. I later received an apology from him AND the head pastor of our church at the way I was treated. Later, the offending pastor and I became great friends, and we joke about it. He is still embarrassed by his behavior, even 5 years later. I forgave him shortly after it happened.

The second time with a new 27 year old guitar player who we all found to be very pushy, egotistical and arrogant. He is a very gifted guitar player and musician, he just alienated everyone he came in contact with. I ended up counseling this young man, gave him some time off to get his heart right, and now he is back; a contributing, gifted, courteous musician who is using his gifts for God. I have become his "champion" and mentor.

In both instances it became clear to me, upon reflection, that Satan was doing his very best to mess me up. When you are doing something really great for God, Satan will try his hardest to prevent it from happening. Perhaps that is what is happening here. Do not let Satan win, he is a liar, among other things.

God must have some great plans for you in this worship environment, if Satan is trying that hard to keep you from playing there. Laugh it off, get right with this other guy, and move on. If that 's the worst that Satan can throw at you, God will be victorious.

Heck, if that had happened to me, I would have stopped the band, myself, told the audience what had happened and told them that this song was just too good to play out of tune and to give me a second. I'm sure they would have chuckled, agreed and you would have won them over with your sense of humor and honesty.

I know you will be righted. Do not let Satan win. There is someone there that you will touch and needs to hear your music.

My rant is finished.

Blessings,
F1

Ferrari 1 · Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2004 5:49 am Post subject:

P.S. I wish I could talk like Steve.

Steve · Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2004 5:56 am Post subject:

sharring · Tiger Joined: 04 Feb 2004 Posts: 812 Location: Texas

Yeah F1, Steve is great. BTW when we stopped i told the audience that if i didn't know better i would think my 6yo was here-adjusting the tuning is something she enjoys! Bro Steve, your "old man" reference is perfect. Not only the "old man" as opposed to the "new man" as per Paul, but i just finished reading "the Old man and the Sea" by Hemmingway. That old man did it by himself too (and look what he ended up with). Also, "carving out a nitch, a place to stand" is a great analogy. I totally agree with it and with your thought's behind it. Yes Steve, i do enjoy playing there. The Pastor is a graduate of the fundimental baptist church i now attend. He knows exactly where i'm coming from (they think P&W is a bad thing) and he does his best to get me to play loud electric guitar. His wife is the song leader and is the same way. I would consider joining this church if it wasnt so far away. The bass player is a young guy who's only experience was playing with a grunge/alt. band. He knows how to blast, but not how to fill or support a vocalist. On my first visit he had his 100watt Marshall head DI'd to the PA-what a terrible sound! But I didn't say anything. Anyway, you are right. We are an egotistical lot. I fight it constantly-and i don't have much to be egotistical about! But that doesn't matter to Satan. I guess i was thinking in my first post that i could just walk away from the whole thing-"No worries, mate". But now i need to talk to him. Should i take my drummer with me, or try to talk to him alone? I don't really know/like the the guy. Be God's-scott

Steve · Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2004 4:19 pm Post subject:

PunkStar · Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2004 10:28 pm Post subject:

To be honest, I never have a problem with my bass player detuning my strings. He always stands to my left. So if he gets out of line, he's right in the way of a quick jab with the headstock. He has to turn around to be able to do the same trick to me. And he'd look stupid trying to do it.

This trick works even better with my Jackson. The picture below isn't exactly it, but close enough.

http://www.jacksonguitars.com/gear/gear.php?partno=JS1_Dinky

Imagine getting a good poke with that. Laughing

Steve · Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 5:21 am Post subject:

Here in California, pointy headstocks are considered "assault weapons" and banned. Wink

PunkStar · Posted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 2:03 am Post subject:

Here in Australia, you can use them as assault weapons and they won't get banned. Wink

Crucified_With_Christ · Posted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 4:52 am Post subject:

sharring, that's rough! I don't know what I'd do. Take the advice of the preachers on this forum is what I'd do, now that I think of it... For myself, i'm usually the one thinking of how I could detune the bass guitarist's guitar. I play with two bassist's that I really don't care for at all. They are both very haughty and they're never wrong - if you know the type... In fact, this past Thursday at practice for Sunday services, the bassist was bragging about how his Fender bass guitar had never gone out of tune. "Never in 16 years", he said. So that following Friday, after playing with my band for the Junior High, I detuned his bass! Hehe! Laughing

Not really out of malice, but more as a joke. This could be seen as the opposite of your situation, but I let him use my tuner when he found out how out of tune it was on Sunday during practice. Haha! Aren't I funny! (Riiiiiight... Rolling Eyes

)

- Tim

PunkStar · Posted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 5:50 pm Post subject:

At least you did your trick outside of performance so no one got a severe public humiliation. But doing it during performance is just mean. My bass player has pretended to do it to me, but has never actually done it. (probably 'cause he knows about the point end of my guitar Laughing

). Besides, I think we have a little more respect than to pull mean tricks like that in a place where we come to worship God.

The other way to fix the problem is to get a guitar with locking tuners. Much like my Jackson actually. I'll have to put up a picture one day.

sharring · Tiger Joined: 04 Feb 2004 Posts: 812 Location: Texas

Tim...reminds me of the time when i came to practice late and found the bass player and the drummer scuffling on the floor. After separating them i asked them what they were fighting about. The drummer yelled "He detuned one of my strings and won't tell me which one!" Rolling Eyes

Be God's-scott

sharring · Tiger Joined: 04 Feb 2004 Posts: 812 Location: Texas

Just a followup to my previous post. Last night my 6yo and i went back to the church. While she played in the playground i had a face-to-face talk with the bass player. He seems very sold out to the Lord-he told me that he's played bongos for Christ before and would do it again! You gotta respect that! He is also very active in the church and does many things besides play. Anyway, to make a long story short, my heart is right and i've got a new friend. Thanks for the great advice guys. It's nice to have someone to whine to! (and my wife thanks you!) Be God's-scott